Why Carly Rae Jepsen is ESFP (to IDRlabs)

By S. Kim

So I wrote and sent my blog post about Gwen Stefani's typing to IDRlabs through email, which they overlooked (probably due to their focus on personality tests). Instead of persistently seeking a response from them regarding my disagreement with their stance on Gwen Stefani's type, I have chosen to write about another person's typing that I also disagree with IDRlabs on. Regarding Carly Rae Jepsen specifically, she, just like Gwen Stefani, is also typed as ENFP, despite me personally believing they are ESFP. In this blog, I will seek to give an explanation as to why I disagree with IDRlabs with regards to Carly Rae Jepsen's type.

Her Direct Focus on the Ever-Changing Object

As Boye Akinwande puts it, “Se ... is an extroverted perception function that doesn’t seek to shape the current object, but to be aware of it in the most direct way possible and to magnify it. By engaging themselves with the relevant and essential objects ... they are able to appeal to a large demographic and flexibly make the most out of the current situation. Se types [can] often [be] singular and direct in pursuit of their goals, making them appear as extroverted judgment types, but through examining the history of their ideas it becomes clear that they are less consistent, more freely adapting themselves to the unordered ever-changing object.” Here are some quotes from Carly Rae Jepson that exemplify the previously stated description of Se:

Jepsen: "Keep your eye on the ball and don't expect that the second record is gonna be at all like the first record, and don't expect what's happening today is necessarily gonna be happening tomorrow." [Source]

Jepsen: "26 years of trying different avenues to hopefully get that breakout in Canada, and that's the goal. And you don't know how it works because there isn't sort of some set rule like 'if you do this, this, and this'. ... When young artists ask me, 'what do you do?' it's sort of like, 'I don't know,' because half my story has been very much based on luck and kind of being in the right place [at the] right time. ... I think about the 3 minimum wage jobs that I was keeping and the posters that I go around putting out myself in Canada. You can't really be too upset getting to travel and do music for a living." [Source]

Jepsen: "You have to understand, this wasn't like 'this happened to me because I casually went into a studio and made a song' ... I had been hustling since I was 7. Like if you were to ask me from age 7 on, 'what do you want to be?' I was like, 'a singer' ... My point is that this is a passion of mine. I couldn't believe it. So, it didn't matter if you had told me to do 14 interviews in 1 day. Didn't matter what the ask was, I was happy to be there. The answer was always yes. I was a little workhorse, but I was just like living my actual dream." [Source]

Jepsen: "The music industry is never going to be like a stagnant thing. It's always constantly evolving, and I think as an artist, what I look at is the challenge [of] figuring out how much you wanna morph around and change and be compatible with like the new stages of what kind of causes growth for your career." [Source]

In all of these quotes, the emphasis is on the realistic awareness of circumstances and making the most out of it. While one might say that Ne types are also capable of having this quality, one thing to consider is that Ne types, according to IDRlabs, "are often in danger of getting a bit high on their own thoughts and associations and then spending a lot of effort on those as opposed to spending a lot of effort on reality." There is also a lack of the transcendental quality that is typically associated with Ne within these quotes in that she is more focused on the immediate situations themselves (e.g. her saying "keep your eye on the ball" and "being in the right place [at the] right time") rather than "overstepping" it to get to the associations. As IDRlabs has said, "Intuition is not Sensation with an extra layer: Intuition oversteps the object, while Sensation remains with it." All else being equal, the quotes shown above, if taken holistically, indicate a preference for Se over any other perceiving function. For an even more concrete example of Se, look no further than the quote below:

Jepsen: "I don't overanalyze a song when I'm listening to it. ... If someone's asking me to, then I think I switch into that brain-head, but I can just kind of enjoy it. That being said, I think everyone can feel when, 'oh first listen, that song is quality and those melodies are so tight, and everything feels right away when I don't even need to listen to give a review on it.' ... It's like a slam dunk first listen. You don't need to go back and get used to it for it to be good." [Source]

In this quote, she is showcasing a preference for experiencing and feeling the object (in this case, a song) out to the fullest, without the need to conceptualize or make associations about it; what Jung coins "the highest pitch of actuality". In other words, her immediate reaction to a song is much more (colloquially) intuitive than associative. As Michael Pierce puts it (in his IDRlabs article: A Definition of Se and Si), "sensation is present so long as it is experienced ... from the thing itself, and not just from an idea about the thing, or a concept associated with the thing. ... For Sensation, it is whatever arises from the thing itself, as it stands, that is of primary psychic importance. Intuition, on the other hand, is not stimulated by the thing itself, but always by ... the associations that could be made on the basis of it. Intuition is concerned with what is about the thing, and not with the thing in itself." 

Now, when discussing about the differences between types and functions in Jungian Typology, it's important to remember that it's always relative. With that said, as we just touched upon eariler, S prioritizes the thing itself, whereas N focuses more on the associations surrounding the thing. If we take it that both S and N are extroverted, then Se "sticks" with the object (an innate attraction on the object itself, whether it'd be physical, abstract, etc.) while Ne bypasses the object and instead explores its intellectual associations (connecting-the-dots in an associstive manner rather than remaining with the objects themselves). To my mind, Jepsen prefers "sticking" with objects rather than "bypassing" them:

Jepsen: "As soon as I got to meet everybody [at the Junos], it was really casual and really laid back. And you know, there's great food, there's great people. And I honestly love the same thing that I loved watching them on TV, which was sort of seeing what everyone's wearing and kind of letting my little girly side come out." [Source]

Jepsen: "I love the way [Carly Simmons] writes, which is very ... to the point; there is not a lot of metaphor to it. But I think it's really relatable and honest. And I love her fashion sense, I love her taste in men [laughs]. I think that there's something really beautiful about that honesty. But also, like a great jazz song, it doesn't need to be totally confusing for it to still be really potent. And I think that sometimes a really direct lyric can be just as powerful, if not more." [Source]

One may argue that the 2nd quote regarding Jepsen's affinity for Simmons' direct and straightforward lyrics is more of a mental content, which I don't necessarily disagree with. I agree that we shouldn't anticipate individuals to communicate their cognitive processes directly (rather, we must construct a representation of the way in which the person's cognition operates) and we shouldn't take everything someone says about themselves at face value with regard to their cognitive process, but if we look at the quote in conjunction with all of the other quotes provided (as opposed to in isolation),  it supports the idea that Jepsen prefers "sticking" with objects rather than "bypassing" them.

Lack of Preference for Introspection 

If one is unfamiliar, IDRlabs adopts Kiersey's idea of merging introspection with Intuition. While I do agree with that idea in a general sense, I wouldn't take that statement too absolutely. From my observation, individuals who are Sensation types can still be introspective, despite Sensation being generally more extrospective than Intuition. Having said that, in my view it is less plausible to find an Intuitive type who is low in introspection than it is to find a Sensation type with decent level of introspection. That is to say that if the individual in question stated or showcased something that indicates a lack of preference for introspection, then it could be a good indicator that the individual is not an Intuitive dominant type (ENFP in this case):

[Interviewer: "Do you have, like, an idea, mantra, a way of viewing the world that you say, 'This is who I'm about'?"]

Jepsen: "I don't know if I really thought about it that much. I think, in general, I try to be really thankful and appreciative for everything that I have. And I think number one, always live in the moment - like be 'here' and be happy that I'm here and be happy that I'm talking to you, you know - and looking forward to seeing how far I can run with it." [Source]

Introspection, as IDRlabs sees it, is "the observation of one’s own mental states ... [and] close to the raw stream of mental experience.” When Carly Rae Jepsen is asked about her worldview or personal philosophy, her response indicates that she hasn't given this question much thought, saying "I really thought about it that much", indicating that she isn't very connected to the raw stream of her mental experience. However, as IDRlabs puts it, "this is not to say that more introspection is necessarily better or that 'Ns are Ss with an extra layer.' Barack Obama, by wide agreement, has a very high level of introspection, but has often been faulted for being indecisive and 'stuck in his own head' for this reason."

Another aspect that is worth mentioning is that, later in the quote, she emphasizes making the most out of a given situation, emphasizing being "in the moment" and "here", and seeing "how far" she can run with it. While some may argue that this aspect of the quote is more of a content (since the interviewer is asking about her personal philosophy) and therefore not a direct component of a type, which I somewhat agree in that while this part is not as strong as my argument regarding her lack of introspection above, it does serve as a good connection for evidence supporting Se considering all of the other evidence.

Introverted Feeling

Fi's values are based on interfacing with themselves (purified from outside influence) whereas Fe's values are based on interfacing with the outside world (informed by outside influence). As IDRlabs has said about Fi, "Introverted Feeling is attuned to the values that are peculiar to the individual’s own consciousness." I agree with IDRlabs that she is an Fi user. To my mind, her Feeling is primarily oriented towards subjective factors; in other words, when push comes to shove with regard to Feeling, she doesn't rely on some kind of external criteria:

Jepsen: "I'm still kinda in my exploration stage with the red carpet, where I think at the beginning I felt like 'oh it has to be this very elegant, sophisticated thing,' and then I would find myself on the red carpet almost playing the part of like this person who I'm not, which is [a] total, total gong show. And I realize more and more that for me, it's actually more important to find something I'm really comfortable in and that I still feel beautiful in, and you know, dress appropriately for the event, but that still feels very like me. ... It's kinda my decision to pick something that excites me." [Source]

Jepsen: "Before anyone had heard [my album] Emotion, I had to kind of figure out how I felt about it and let that be the truth. And then it landed for me as just something really honest that I felt passionate about. I was really proud of it and happy to share it, but I felt like whatever happens now could go either way. ... I just don't want to feel like it couldn't have gone the other way and that would have changed my feeling of it." [Source]

Jepsen: "I know some performers ... got like this stage idea, [but] I feel like I'm just myself, and I'm myself performing, and I'm myself at home. And obviously, you get to be a little bit more theatrical and over the top when you're on stage, but that's a very sincere part of my personality." [Source]

Jepsen: "I feel like I don't have to have an authentic self and a non-authentic self that I have to put a shield on or some make-up. I think that it's kind of maybe why I do shy away from big, big, big styles of celebrity life because I think you could get lost in that, and I try very hard not to. ... It's just not the part that appeals to me of 'what it is to be a musician'. It's much more about the music than it is about the fame." [Source]

Additional Notes

Moving on to this final bit, this part will take a step back from the functional approach and focus more on the general tendencies of the ESFP. As a disclaimer, typology is about cognition, the general tendencies exist because the functions in a certain order can often manifest in certain recognizable ways. But the keyword there is "often" and not "will." So all that to say, correlation is not causation (this really seems to be a problem in the typological community) and the general tendencies that will be mentioned are incidental and not essential. 

However, with all that said, if we look at this section in conjunction with all of the evidence provided (as opposed to as an island unto itself), I think it's a good addition. Now that we got that disclaimer out of the way, IDRlabs in their ESFP description has stated that "most ESFPs love to live vivaciously and will approach their tasks and hobbies in a spontaneous and energetic manner where they see life as an adventure" and that "their primary interest lies in seeking out all that life has to offer, and exploring a multitude of adventures in search of mindfulness and self-expression. ... ESFPs tend to be people and imminence oriented", both of those characteristics fit Carly Rae Jepsen very well:

Jepsen: "If you saw even the background leading up to getting any success in Canada, it was a long, sort of treacherous hike. ... Even when it wasn't working, I had no intention of giving up. I'll be like, 'Well, this will still be a fun adventure to try forever.'" [Source]

Jepsen: "I wanna keep touring. I wanna keep making music that's always like a 'what album can I make next' kind of feeling. It's just in my blood for sure, but I have a whole list of goals. I'm really excited about getting to shift direction at some point into the Broadway world. I don't know what that looks like, but that's always been a dream of mine - to kind of redirect focus into theater. But right now, I'm just enjoying getting to tour and celebrate this album." [Source]